In and Out - BAK and Exhaust questions

[r.borders]

So, I've got a couple questions. Let's start with the in. I've got Baron's BAK on the bike. A while back, just like nearly everybody else, I started getting a fair amount of oil coming out of the crankcase vent filter. I should note that I had the dealer install it in the first place, so we're just going to have to assume everything was done correctly. Oil was getting on the rear cylinder head, the left side cover, and my pants on occasion. I didn't really want to install a catch can because I didn't want to have to rig it nor empty it on occasion, so I just ran a line down to the right side of the bike right in front of the vertical frame member where the right passenger foot peg bolts on to and below the lower frame member. That completely cleared up all oil splatter on the engine, cover, and me. Everything seemed fine for a long while until recently. I know that the whole point of the line is to let the oil drain to the ground, and it did before, but now it seems to be doing it a little excessively - I don't know if it maybe has something to do with the cooler temperatures. This morning (appx. 35 degrees) I started it up and let it run a minute or two as I put my helmet and gloves on. As I did that, I noticed probably 5 or so drops come out. This has been pretty typical lately. I figured maybe it was just condensation coming out and decided this time to check it when I got to work and the bike had really warmed up completely. Much to my chagrin, when I pulled into work I checked it only to find a few drops had already come out in the short time it took to just to get off the bake and walk around it. I gave the throttle a couple twists to see if anything more would come out and a little did, though it was a few seconds after I twisted the throttle. I figured I’d try it this afternoon when I left work and it was a little warmer (high 50s probably) and see what happened…same thing right when I fired it up,  and it spit out a few drops when I got home and parked too. So anyway, does this amount of leakage seem excessive to anyone? Had I just not noticed before that that much was coming out?

Ok, now on to the out. For the past couple months or, I've been going to work early enough in the morning that it's dark out. I've noticed when I look in the sideview mirrors and there is a vehicle behind me with its lights shining, that when I twist the throttle a lot of dust or smoke comes out of the bike. I'd noticed this a few times before riding at night, but had always attributed it to the fact that my pipes point at the ground at maybe a 45 degree angle - being as dusty as it is in ABQ, I figured I was just kicking up dust on the roads. (More to that point, I've had friends who, while riding behind me, told me that I kicked up a ton of dust when I accelerate really hard). But more recently since I’ve been paying more attention to the bike. It really doesn’t like starting in the cold, and with as hard of a time as it has starting, I noticed first the amount of condensation that comes out of the exhaust when I first fire it up. This, thankfully, stops after its warmed up fully. The smoke or dust out of the exhaust, however, happens ALWAYS when it’s dark, there’s a car behind me, and I open up the throttle, regardless of how long the bike’s been running. Any ideas? Could it just be dust after all, or could something be off with the engine?

If anyone actually took the time to read this tome, I really appreciate it.

[t84a]

May be something as simple as overfilled oil.

[r.borders]

Oh, I meant to post this link regarding the crankcase vent. I'm not sure if the system's the same as that on the bike, but it was an interesting read and I feel like I now have a better understanding of what the hell the 'crankcase vent hose' listed in Baron's instruction manual really does (did).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankcase_ventilation_system

[r.borders]

May be something as simple as overfilled oil.

I checked it just the other day and it was pretty much right in the middle of the min/max fill lines 

[Capt_Zoom]

too much oil is the most likely cause...you might have just purged out to get to normal.  That said monitor your oil level in upcoming days.  If it continues to go lower it might be an indication of bad rings...unlikely but possible.

as far as the exhaust goes, have someone ride behind you during the day and see if you're pushing a lot of black smoke.  If so you're running rich.  If not that its likely just he dust you were referring to.

[TRaider_John]

The "leakage" is completely dependent upon how much blow by  you are getting.  Normal wear of the piston rings allow a a small amount of the high energy gas in the combustion zone to leak by into the crank case.  That gas is what creates the positive pressure in the crank case and is vented out through the hose.  It carries with it oil vapors.  The water vapor in the exhaust and the oil vapors condense in the tube resulting in the liquid you get dripping out.  A small amount is normal and what you seem to be getting seems normal to me.

What you are seeing in the exhaust seems to be the result of a rich mixture (my opinion).  When you crack the throttle open the engine gets more fuel and the unburned or poorly burned fuel causes a white plume (oil plumes are grey to black).  The increased water vapor in the exhaust contributes to the plume even in a well tuned engine.  You didn't mention a fuel management system.  If you don't have one, I can nearly guarantee that the stock EFI system is enriching the mixture at large throttle openings, even with the BAK.  If you have a fuel management system, it may be maladjusted.  Or what you are seeing could be perfectly normal. 

[Capt_Zoom]

The "leakage" is completely dependent upon how much blow by  you are getting.  Normal wear of the piston rings allow a a small amount of the high energy gas in the combustion zone to leak by into the crank case.  That gas is what creates the positive pressure in the crank case and is vented out through the hose.  It carries with it oil vapors.  The water vapor in the exhaust and the oil vapors condense in the tube resulting in the liquid you get dripping out.  A small amount is normal and what you seem to be getting seems normal to me.

What you are seeing in the exhaust seems to be the result of a rich mixture (my opinion).  When you crack the throttle open the engine gets more fuel and the unburned or poorly burned fuel causes a white plume (oil plumes are grey to black).  The increased water vapor in the exhaust contributes to the plume even in a well tuned engine.  You didn't mention a fuel management system.  If you don't have one, I can nearly guarantee that the stock EFI system is enriching the mixture at large throttle openings, even with the BAK.  If you have a fuel management system, it may be maladjusted.  Or what you are seeing could be perfectly normal.

TRJ said it much better than I could.  +1

[A.T.]

Sounds like your bike is getting on in years and miles, and there may be a combination of issues.

Concerning the smoke/dust, have the BAK filters been cleaned? Depending on how much you ride and in what conditions, them things need to be cleaned at least twice yearly.  It's a pain but it needs to be done or you're not running with 'nuf air.

Hard starting may be the battery - these batts seem to work well then rapidly just give up.  How old is the battery?

Not sure what your service history is...regular servicing - plugs, etc?

Oil build up....congealed oil in the overboard hose probably. 

Do let us know what you find and stop looking behind you!   

[r.borders]

The "leakage" is completely dependent upon how much blow by  you are getting.  Normal wear of the piston rings allow a a small amount of the high energy gas in the combustion zone to leak by into the crank case.  That gas is what creates the positive pressure in the crank case and is vented out through the hose.  It carries with it oil vapors.  The water vapor in the exhaust and the oil vapors condense in the tube resulting in the liquid you get dripping out.  A small amount is normal and what you seem to be getting seems normal to me.

What you are seeing in the exhaust seems to be the result of a rich mixture (my opinion).  When you crack the throttle open the engine gets more fuel and the unburned or poorly burned fuel causes a white plume (oil plumes are grey to black).  The increased water vapor in the exhaust contributes to the plume even in a well tuned engine.  You didn't mention a fuel management system.  If you don't have one, I can nearly guarantee that the stock EFI system is enriching the mixture at large throttle openings, even with the BAK.  If you have a fuel management system, it may be maladjusted.  Or what you are seeing could be perfectly normal.

I do indeed have a PCV, but I've always suspected that it wasn't tuned correctly...

Sounds like your bike is getting on in years and miles, and there may be a combination of issues.

Concerning the smoke/dust, have the BAK filters been cleaned? Depending on how much you ride and in what conditions, them things need to be cleaned at least twice yearly.  It's a pain but it needs to be done or you're not running with 'nuf air.

I don't think it really has that many miles - only 7300 or so. I haven't ever cleaned the filters, though, so maybe that would help (I've only had it since Feb. '11, so I don't imagine they're completely clogged up). What's the best way going about cleaning them? I don't remember from the last time I had the tank off how they're connected to the intake manifold. And just rinse em out with water or something?

Hard starting may be the battery - these batts seem to work well then rapidly just give up.  How old is the battery?

Regarding the starting, I don't think the battery's going, because that thing will keep trying to get the bike started for quite some time. Real time, it probably takes 3-5 seconds for it to actually start on the cold days. One time, the bike actually turned off after starting and I had to re-start it again.

Not sure what your service history is...regular servicing - plugs, etc?

Service history is what's recommended - had the 600 (or was it 700) mile break in tune up as well as the 4000 mile one. Coming up here on the 8000 mile one.

Oil build up....congealed oil in the overboard hose probably. 

What's the overboard hose?

Do let us know what you find and stop looking behind you!   

I've got 4 sets of eyes, looking in all directions at all times lol

[Capt_Zoom]

With your PCV did you get a personalized tune or are you using one of dynojet's maps?  The dynojet maps are often not quite right once you add a BAK.

[TRaider_John]

Could it be that what you are seeing is perfectly normal?

[r.borders]

With your PCV did you get a personalized tune or are you using one of dynojet's maps?  The dynojet maps are often not quite right once you add a BAK.

It's a DJ map - not a unique tune. How much does it usually cost to get it dyno'd and all that?

Could it be that what you are seeing is perfectly normal?

Who knows, maybe it is lol

[t84a]

If the bike runs good, I wouldn't waste the money on a tune. It can run several hundred dollars. Keep an eye on your oil level and make sure you are checking it correctly.

[Capt_Zoom]

With your PCV did you get a personalized tune or are you using one of dynojet's maps?  The dynojet maps are often not quite right once you add a BAK.

It's a DJ map - not a unique tune. How much does it usually cost to get it dyno'd and all that?

Could it be that what you are seeing is perfectly normal?

Who knows, maybe it is lol

Try a couple of the maps that members have loaded for your morton pipes and bak.  You might find that a new map might solve your exhaust problems.  The ccv is another case...its going to happen...just the nature of this and most motor designs.  I find that even if you put the vent really high and forward it still eventually starts to mist oil.  So I just run mine down the left side between the motor and the left cover (where you release the seat) then down behind the kickstand. 

If you have bad rings its going to push a lot of oil.  Take the budget moving truck I had in August.  From minnesota to Louisiana it pushed 13 gallons of oil out and onto my trailer'ed jeep.

If its bad rings you're eventually have trouble keeping oil in it.  to my knowledge nobody on here has reported a bad set of rings yet.

[r.borders]

With your PCV did you get a personalized tune or are you using one of dynojet's maps?  The dynojet maps are often not quite right once you add a BAK.

It's a DJ map - not a unique tune. How much does it usually cost to get it dyno'd and all that?

Could it be that what you are seeing is perfectly normal?

Who knows, maybe it is lol

Try a couple of the maps that members have loaded for your morton pipes and bak.  You might find that a new map might solve your exhaust problems.  The ccv is another case...its going to happen...just the nature of this and most motor designs.  I find that even if you put the vent really high and forward it still eventually starts to mist oil.  So I just run mine down the left side between the motor and the left cover (where you release the seat) then down behind the kickstand. 

If you have bad rings its going to push a lot of oil.  Take the budget moving truck I had in August.  From minnesota to Louisiana it pushed 13 gallons of oil out and onto my trailer'ed jeep.

If its bad rings you're eventually have trouble keeping oil in it.  to my knowledge nobody on here has reported a bad set of rings yet.

Here's to hoping I'm not the first haha